Save Your Unsubscribes with Custom Preference Pages feat. Shaun Pereira

Narrator 0:00
You’re listening to the all systems go podcast, the show that teaches you everything you need to know to put your business on autopilot. Learn how to deploy automated marketing and sale systems in your business the right way with your host, the professor of automation himself and founder of automation bridge, Chris Davis.

Chris 0:30
Welcome everybody to another episode of The all systems go podcast. I’m your host, Chris L. Davis. And today, we’re going to discuss a topic that is extremely important in today’s day and age, you know, where we’re in a time where email deliverability, security, lists growth, all of these things are paramount. There was a day and age where you would be kind of like a unicorn if you knew these terms, and we’re doing these things. But now it’s really more tongue in cheek for the regular business owner and digital marketer. And along with that comes a responsibility to make sure that you can properly manage people based on their preferences. And that’s what we’re going to be discussing today, a new software that I’m looking forward to you meeting the founder and the software of and our guest for today is Sean Pereira. And at just 25 years, young, Sean is already making waves as a visionary entrepreneur, with a proven track record as the founder of a contact sharing company, which he successfully sold Shaun now leads email pref, the software that we’ll be talking about today as a CEO, and he’s passionate about simplifying user preferences, while empowering businesses to gain deeper insights into their users when he’s not revolutionising the tech world. You can find him enjoying a cup of coffee or cheering his favorite football team on the weekends. Sean, welcome to the podcast. So glad to have you. How you doing?

Shaun Pereira 2:20
Thank you so much, Chris, for this invitation. All good. Yeah, just bad weather knocks that I’m right now, but excited for this podcast?

Chris 2:27
Yes, yes. And I want to give people some quick insight on how we connected. I actually can’t remember how I learned how I learned to have the software. But the minute I saw what it could do, especially and specifically for Active Campaign, it was a no brainer, you were very, very receptive of my outreach. And we connected you shared the vision for the software to me, I caught the vision immediately. And I was like, Oh, my goodness, all my years there, all of the customer complaints. And I think tanks that we had internally have things we can do. And thankfully, somebody finally took the sword took the took the flag out, say and went to the finish line with it. And now we have email prep. So so let us know, Shawn, what where did the idea of email prep come from?

Shaun Pereira 3:31
So take a step back before that actually, before preference, or do we just simply an unsubscribe link. And as you know, all companies believe in innovation and all that’s what we also actually strongly believe in as our company. So founders vision was basically to keep something really simple for the end customer to use, since he wanted non technical and technical users to set up email. And in an easy way. So going back again, we started with an unsubscribe link. And we’re not speaking to customers, we’re sending out cold emails. That’s when I realized, oh, people actually ask for beautiful preference. And though there’s no actually software, which can actually help customers, like businesses create a beautiful preference center where they can include the logo favicon and decide the list they want to show on the preference center. So with that, we just started with a small POC, and we targeted the Campaign Monitor first, the response was really good. And one of the campaign monitors actually use Active Campaign. And they told us they’re switching. And that’s how they told us Oh, could you make a preference and Active Campaign? So we made a preference and effective campaign. And that’s when we realized the users told us that Oh, like Active Campaign does not have a preference and it just has. So this is where we learned and we pivoted email prep into complementing Active Campaign and having a whole group preference and for all the Active Campaign users. Love

Chris 4:46
it, love it in. Just so everybody is tracking on the same plane here when we talk about preference centers. Think about when you send an email or how about this think about when you receive it. Email, and you click that unsubscribe, or perhaps they have a update, your preferences are your subscription button at the bottom at the footer of the email, you click it, and it takes you to this page shake of the dice. It’s a well optimized page or what sometimes you click in and it’s just like, your your settings have been saved. And you’re like, what settings. But usually, if the software does it, right, there’s a page where it can, it will show all of the lists or all of the types of messaging that you’re subscribed to. So you look because what happens often, Shawn is that I opt in to something a contact may opt in for something, but they don’t know all the list that they’re being added to, they don’t know the back end messaging structure and setup. So a lot of times when you click on that, unsubscribe link, or update, it’s your first time seeing all of the things that you’ve been subscribed to. And now I can select and say, Hey, I don’t want this, but I want this or, Hey, remove me from everything. So this is the software that Sean has built, Sean and his company have have built that integrates so tightly with Active Campaign. As before that I think you had to do, like Active Campaign form, with lists, and it was limited to lists, you know. So in in comes email press. And just describe to us how how you handle the preference page building, and then the association with lists and tags and things of that nature.

Shaun Pereira 6:38
So let me just jump in and share my screen pretty quick. And again, just show them a setup. If that works. Yes. So this is on the left hand side, as you see, it’s my email prep dashboard. And on the right hand side, it’s my Active Campaign sandbox. So I’ll jump through stuff really quick here, since I just want to show you Oh, you saw right now just add the integration with Active Campaign. So I’ll click on add the integration, and keep track of campaign. I’ll just create Sean podcast that just won’t show on podcast here. And we asked for an API key and URL. This is for a secure integration, you can find that information under Settings on your Active Campaign sandbox, which is on the developer URL change or reset my API key and you are allowed for this. So just to be safe.

Chris 7:20
For those of you watching video, it will not work if you try. For those of you listen, yeah, Shawn is just showing your regular interface of going into Active Campaign grabbing your API key, putting it in an email prep. And that’s what’s going to authorize that initial connection to allow it to start to read data from Active Campaign.

Shaun Pereira 7:42
Okay, that’s exactly what I’ve mentioned. And we also have enterprise security. So this adds a UU ID as a custom field on Active Campaign. This is only for enterprise levels currently. So I’ll just accept. And this will give me a pop up saying sit back and relax, while we are syncing all your lists. So this is what I really want to emphasize on sit back and relax. This is where evil breath actually starts to work. So I’ll just show you my list from Active Campaign right now, if I just go into sandbox and click list, I can see all my lists from Active Campaign here on the right hand side. So now when email ref does the work, if I show you the list tab on email prep, this fetches all your list and tags from active campaigns, Yes. and gets it to email prep. So this is where the customer does not have to do anything does not have to create a Sync does not have to create a bidirectional thing, not a one way sync nothing. All they have to do is create an integration. This is how easy we are making it for users right now. And the last step is on the email breath creating actions. So we also create default actions for users. So any page made on the preference page, we send it back to Active Campaign in real time for real time updates between active campaign and email press.

Chris 8:54
Yes, so the last step, yep, keep going. No, drive this thing.

Shaun Pereira 9:02
Perfect. So the last step, Chris, which everyone is actually very fussy, is create your reference page. So we have kept it really simple. I’ll just click Create Page right here. We asked you for particular data to keep the reference page as per your brand guidelines. So your company name, I’ll just put Shawn here pretty quick. And he’ll be a spot. So the main reason we have kept apart is because we allow you to create multiple reference pages. So say you have different target markets, different target audiences, you can have a different reference page for all the target audiences keep it simpler for your audiences also at the same time, so I’ll just keep preferences you’re pretty quick. And we also have logo and favicon to customize the page completely. So we also have customize the page where you can change the colors which is really simple. If you click on the color will change and you can also change the button color. The most interesting part is the list. Email draft gives you two predefined list, but I’ll just delete this since I’m showing you an Active Campaign integration completely. So I’ll delete this and click on Add list. So we give you a drop down and a search box at the same time. So now if I click on the drop down, it will show me the list from Active Campaign specifically. So if you see your the list, I see all the lists on my left, and on the right and Active Campaign, I can see all the lists. So let’s see, I’ll select master contact list. Okay. And right now I can change the name on email prep. So the master contact listed on Active Campaign. But what I want to show the customer is what I can define in the name and description to help the users understand what types of emails they will receive, and when. So this helps you segment your users basically. So I’ll just keep master contact list and I’ll just add members only just to give an understanding so you can change the description to whatever you like. And description. I’ll keep member news. Member news unsafe. I’ll add another list which is what Chris which lists the one marketing newsletters.

Chris 10:51
Let’s let’s do newsletters,

Shaun Pereira 10:53
newsletters, Okay, should I keep it automation bridge newsletters, yes. Automation bridge. News, I’ll just give automation bridge news now. So you can give the description as as for whatever you want just to make it clear for your audience what the subscribing to or what they’re unsubscribing from. And save. So I’ll just add another list also, which is sales, and just keep it one on one just to understand what’s happening. And save. So as you can see on the right, we already have a preview of our preference page.

Chris 11:26
So the last thing, we want to catch everyone up real quick, Shawn, as you’re moving, what what’s happening for those of you listening, you’re just like, oh, wow, this is it sounds cool. We’ve at he’s synced active campaign with email prep, it has pulled in all of the lists from Active Campaign. So check mark there. However, one of the things that that email prep allows you to do is create various preference pages. So you may have a preference page for leads maybe a different one for customers, maybe a different one for partners, right? Just to give a different experience. And you can set up different lists that they can be a part of or not now, email PrEP has lists that can connect to Active Campaign lists, tags or custom fields, right. I think all three

Shaun Pereira 12:24
are just tags, how many tags, tags and list? We are working on customizing this? Yes.

Chris 12:29
So what you’re doing is you’re creating your so this may be a little confusing for people because they’re like, but here are my lists. What is a list and Active Campaign and email prep? When I’d already synced my list? Why am I creating more? This is the override that you’ve been waiting for. Now, you can say, Okay, I have a main list. But I really have three topics that I mail on for that main list. With those three things. I have a mailing list, I send a newsletter, I send a podcast announcement and I sin webinar updates. Well, I can create an inactive campaign. Those are just tags, right that create segments. So now an email pref, I can create lists that are connected with those tags. And now when someone as you see on the screen, when someone clicks the toggle to say, hey, I want that type of communication. I don’t want this type of communication, though it’s a list in email pref. It’s actually toggling the tag condition and or list condition to add it or remove it to make it true. So that you don’t have to do anything but continue to send to your list in your segments. And email. pref is really handling all the management of your of your contacts.

Shaun Pereira 13:50
I think you hit the nail right on its head. I couldn’t have explained it better. But I just show that also we can show the customers about tags also. Yes, so I’ll just say of the preference page right now. And we can show a preview of a preference page. So I’ll just take contacts. Let’s take one of my contacts make it easy for my sandbox. Yeah,

Chris 14:09
and I’ll say this. There’s two platforms that I commonly unsubscribe from, because I get a lot of emails. But the pages that I see the most are HubSpot and Ontraport Ontraport are two that have a really I will say functional unsubscribe experience where you can where it does list everything that you’re part of haven’t seen it with key yet or maybe CLEVEO does it as well. ActiveCampaign doesn’t do it. Anyways. So some of you may have already seen pages like this and didn’t just didn’t realize that that’s a preference page.

Shaun Pereira 14:47
Exactly. So going back to the demo itself, we’re showing right now after Chris said or even for makes it really easy for you. If you have an integration listed in the on your dashboard and the reference page. It gives you the link which you can copy and paste in your Active Campaign template. So you don’t have to do anything, just copy this link and paste it in your Active Campaign template. So right now just a quick demo with [email protected]. So I’ll just put the query string email here [email protected]. And so this will take me to a different page, legal reference page. Okay, so now we see Shawn is the scribe of sales, unsubscribe from newsletter, and unsubscribe from Master contact, let’s, let’s see if this is the information shown in Active Campaign. So if I go to Active Campaign and see Sean has unsubscribed from Moscow and abuse, which is the right information on display from newsletters, and only subscribe to sales. So this is actually the right information from the reference page. So let’s just toggle something off and on and reference page. So let’s play around, say, and describe them sales, subscribe to newsletters, and subscribe to my contact list. And do not forget to save your preference pages. Because this is where it gives you a pop up, your preferences have been saved. Okay, so I’ll just go to a campaign refresh this real quick. And if you see all the information on Active Campaign will be related in real time. So if you see I unsubscribe from sales, subscribe to my contact list. And now we have newsletters, also. So this is how email pref actually functions with Active Campaign. Just Just one last thing close, I just want to show the information relayed from Active Campaign to email prep. So say by mistake if a user subscribes, if you want to change it to Active Campaign, I’ll just put unsubscribe here. So I changed this on Active Campaign. So now let’s see if the information on email prep really is the same in real time. If so, the webhook we have received is a little late, let me just check this again,

Chris 16:46
is checking that everyone, what you’re seeing or listening to is the rate, the live sync when something is taking place. And you’re on email prep the preference page that you set up, you’re saying, hey, the contact is saying I no longer want this. And I no longer want that. We log into Active Campaign. And it’s showing exactly that. So we’ve got lists and Active Campaign, integrated with email prep, email PrEP has lists that display to the customer. And now the customer is controlling the customer is in full control now of what is taking place in Active Campaign in terms of what list they’re on and what type of messaging they receive.

Shaun Pereira 17:33
Exactly. And again, Chris does a really good use case since I made a change in Active Campaign. And as you can see, the change is not live in email prep. So this is basically the webhook from Active Campaign has been delayed or come late to us. So this is where email prep doesn’t nightly sync. So all these errors do not happen. So if that customer changed the preference for the day, we do have a Nike thing in place, which before the next campaign is sent out, all these preferences are taken in place, and it’s updated in real time. So this is actually a really good use case for Kim, on this live right now on the podcast.

Chris 18:03
Beautiful, beautiful. And and I’ll say this, it’s time every one for you to start thinking how to properly manage and maintain your database in a way that now you have a preference page really makes sense. Right? So now, maybe in we know it’s a little tough. Well, it’s very tough right now in active campaign with with segments at the time of recording, hopefully, at the time of you listening, they’ve made an update, or at least something. But it’s really hard to see those segments, those who are experienced in the space can have a list and then have tags or custom fields that create segments that people send to. Well, what we’ve had to do in the past is add a link to the bottom that’s above the unsubscribe link and say, Hey, if you no longer want this type of communication, click here. And they click here. And then it either removes a tag or updates a custom field or so on. And that segment and then they’re removed from that segment. Well, email prep comes right in and says hey, look, we got it from here. Just create a page tell us what type of communication you would like people to be able to subscribe to or unsubscribe from. And we’ll handle all of the tag removal and toggling and lists subscription and unsubscription. So really powerful, powerful application and speaking of applications, Shawn, what are some of the the most prevalent and powerful use cases that you’ve seen lately or just over the time of customers that use email prep?

Shaun Pereira 19:49
So firstly, use case right now we will make a use case where we have is on tags because what people want to do is add a listen to your breath and link it to a particular tag. So this is where they can segment the audience in is a really good way this is actually going over what you said again, but if like a company does not have not seen this working in real time, so I would like to show that in another video probably possibly down the line. But basically, once they see this in real time and live to like, wow, this is actually sending real time updates and helping a segment of customers. So from a business perspective, they are understanding the customers in a better way. And from a user perspective, they are receiving the information they want to receive and not getting spammed by the companies. So this is one of the major use cases. The other one will be I’ve seen is a spike in people updating preferences. And some people actually using a lot of lists. One of our big clients actually use a lot of lists, they are our final, final key contacts, and they use a lot of lists. So they just sent an email saying that, hey, you guys can update the preferences. And they have 10 different lists. They saw like a 120 7% spike, which actually customers updated their preferences instead of just unsubscribing from everything. So this actually played a major role in user retention, which the company just came to us. He was like, Why did you guys not reach out to us? And we’re like, we didn’t know you guys actually needed this. So here we are.

Chris 21:07
And again, it speaks to the the reality that your contacts don’t know, they received an email, went to a landing page, maybe saw your stuff in an ad on social media. And they said, oh, I want that. Or hey, I would like to receive communication around that. They didn’t realize that they’re also getting other versions, or maybe there’s derivatives of that type of messaging. So just so it’s it just because it’s a newsletter, they didn’t realize that perhaps they’re also getting podcast announcements. And maybe they don’t want that maybe they’re like, oh, wow, this is great. Such added value, I only got one thing and I signed up for one. And I’m getting to as long as your communication is clear. So now when they say, Well, look, you know what I’m tired of getting these announcements. Let me just get out of here. And they think that that’s all you are, are just announced podcasts announcements, they say, Okay, I’m done. And then they go to this preference page. And I say, oh, wait a minute, I didn’t realize I could just get the newsletter and not the product updates or podcast announcements. In fact, I actually don’t need the newsletter, I just need the product updates. And they’re still they’re still a valuable contact that you can reach and that you can continue to send messaging to all because you’ve properly handled the unsubscribe process. So it was really good to hear that a use case of 500,000 contacts, were able to some of those we’re able to be saved. Speaking of sizes, email prep, is it for businesses of all sizes, or their particular sweet spot? It’s like, Hey, you get the most out of this platform, if you’re this size of database or whatnot, or does it not matter?

Shaun Pereira 23:00
To be honest with it does not matter. We want to help all the businesses using Active Campaign and other ESPs also at the same time. So we don’t want to keep it like oh, if you’re a small business, we want cater to you. Of course, we will guarantee you we care about you. It’s not like we’re not going to give you support. But we want you to take the best use make the best use out of email press even if you’re small objects. But if it’s already a use case, we’re happy to help you. Yep, yeah,

Chris 23:23
well, that’s, that’s good. Shawn, I have to put myself on display here. And I’m saying this so that everybody can can understand that you’re not the only ones that struggle, okay. I was so excited when I got email prep, the first thing that I did, I jumped into my active campaign account, I was like, I’m ready to go. And I realized every one I had just just by the nature of doing things on the fly and, you know, updating as you need to I step back, and I committed one of my own cardinal sins, which is never use negative logic. So don’t say has not, don’t say no to something that has not been done because then that’s yes, no and no equals yes. Confusing every time I even say it. But I realized I was using negative logic. I was using negative logic to do my to do my segmentation, which essentially meant, if you don’t have this tag, then send the information, information or flip it. If you say I don’t want this information, then we tag you as you don’t want the information. So in that case, it it would invert the logic for email prep. And I’m saying that to say now was a great time for you to audit all to start thinking about how are you managing your your preferences. Again, this was email prep didn’t exist at the time that I made this decision and for the team in my execution. And at the time, it was easy to just apply a tag, and that tag removed them from a segment. So I had to reimagine and redo how we run unsubscribes. For someone just getting started, are there some pointers that you would give, give that new user, Shawn, to be able to get started in the most clean and streamlined fashion?

Shaun Pereira 25:24
So, to be honest, I don’t I’m not a big user of Active Campaign. So I can’t advise on this. But from the customers I’ve spoken to, a lot of people are using list and ads at the same time. And when it comes to email prep, they just think email prep works with lists. But not my first question to them always is, what are you working with? Are you working with lists or tags, and they tell me I’m working with list, but basically on tags, I’m just using, oh, if this customer clicks on this property, they’re interested in this also. So I was like, okay, so email draft solves the use case on list, and tags also at the same time. So basically, what I tell them is first, solve the use case on list. And then whenever you use case and list to solve, then jump on the tags. But if you mix, you can also mix it like that doesn’t matter. But it should fit exactly in your workflow and not take time of that business to change the complete workflow. That’s what our main goal and perspective is on this right now.

Chris 26:16
Yeah, it goes without saying but worth repeating that your sentiment of positive sentiment across your email database is going to go a long way. They are cracking down everyone we are in the midst of this last year, they did it, Apple did a big privacy update. This year, Google and Yahoo did a big update with their email deliverability and authenticating your service sending it is going to be extremely important that you maintain a positive sentiment in relationship with your database. Because all of these email providers are looking for that, hey, are people saying this is spam are people unsubscribing at a very high rate. So you want to be able to use tools and leverage tools that allow you to keep that positive sentiment, instead of somebody saying this is spam. When they unsubscribe, they can say oh, wait a minute. Actually, I don’t want any of it goodbye. Because we want to unsubscribe, we don’t want to spam complaint, we want to unsubscribe. So this is giving you another layer of clarity to communicate exactly what people are getting, I would like to go to the next level Shawn and say, you on your landing pages or wherever you’re getting collecting this information, make sure you are very clear with the communication that they will receive. If at any point, if at any point, you’re sending them information. In addition, say hey, look, sign up for our daily newsletter. And then there’s a promotion that’s coming up. And you’re like, oh, I want to send everybody who signed up for a daily newsletter. And you didn’t explicitly state that they would also receive promotions, we’ll make sure you have a tool like email pref that now has email promotions attached to either a tag or list. So when they see it, and they say wait, why are you promoting to me new stuff, I just wanted to newsletter and they click unsubscribe, they can go to a page and say, Oh, yes, I still want to newsletter just toggle off these new promotions. So it’s a way to protect yourself and maintain positive sentiment in the marketplace for your list. Shawn what what can we everybody that has that has been listening may be excited those who were are on YouTube following. By the way if you’re not subscribed to the automation bridge YouTube channel where you can see these demos with with founders like Sean when they walk through their software and attend live when I record these, you can do that at automation bridge.com For slash subscribe, but what what do you got in the oven? What’s what’s next for email prep? What are the things on the horizon that you’ve got your binoculars locked into and forging forward for?

Shaun Pereira 29:11
So actually, it’s what Chris has suggested, like when I was talking to Chris, he told me he’s having a problem with his paid users and unpaid users, because Chris has a community where he has paid users and unpaid users and basically the problem what Chris was facing, I mean, correct me if I’m wrong, Chris. But the problem he was facing is his paid users wanted to receive more emails from him and wanting to hear more from him. What is unpaid users also wanted to hear from him. But since they’re not paying him, he wants to send different emails to his paid users and unpaid users. So this is directly with it coincides with email preference, dynamic lists, visibility, so you can show and hide list on your preference page, depending if that customer has a particular tag of paid or whatever. And that could come in, depending on how you set it up. All this is made on the backend right now and we onboarding customers Currently right now, and it’s really interesting, because that’s a really cool feature all because of you, Chris, actually, thanks to you for that feature, selection, and we onboarding all the customers right now for that one. And the last one is language support just for different languages.

Chris 30:14
Yeah, that’s good. And I want to say this. The reason why this even came up between Shawn and I was because we often have this misconception of bothering our customers, we don’t want to scare them away shot, it’s like they gave us money, don’t say anything to them anymore, just leave them be. And that’s actually the opposite of what they want. A lot of times they want to be in the know, they want to, they don’t want to be left out, you know, if you’ve got really good content, they’re like, Hey, can I get some of that. And what I found is that sometimes people will even opt in again, with a different email just so they can get the non customer emails. So they don’t want to be left out. So that may be something that’s taking place in your business, now you have a tool to allow you to more easily keep them involved. And if they don’t, they can easily say, You know what, I’m fine with just logging in and getting that experience. So, Shawn, I can’t thank you enough for stopping by and showing us email prep, thank you, personally, for creating this tool. My team is underway working heavily to get this implemented. So by the time you all hear this podcast, if you have an email for me, and you hit update, you should see a nice email prep page with my logo at the top. Now you know where it came from. And now you know, the founder. So for those that want to learn more about email prep, get set up, what’s the pricing structure? Where can they go to find out more and get an account started?

Shaun Pereira 31:53
Everything’s live on the website, I get an email pref.com. And everything’s on the website, shall I just pop out the website real quick? Sure. So okay, so on my screen right now, you’ll be able to see it. So if you just pop in the pricing, pricing is live on the website at the bottom, which is we have essentials, which is up to 5000 users, that’s $10 a month. And we have different features. So our most popular one is the Pro. This is basically because what I mentioned, Chris, actually dynamic, dynamic lists, show and hide. A lot of people are opting into this. And we have a lot of users on Plus plan and enterprise enterprises. customers with more than 100k users. So we have 10 customers right now in enterprise and a lot of people on plus right now two plus nine. So this is the pricing right now. Don’t forget to use Chris’s code, you guys will get a discount. Chris, if you can mention your code on that one.

Chris 32:48
Yes, yes. Automation bridge. Yeah. Yes, it

Shaun Pereira 32:52
just automation bridge. So use Chris’s code, and you guys will get a discount for that one.

Chris 32:56
Yes. And everybody, the code is in the shownotes. It’s hyperlink, you can just click it or copy it go and get your discount with email prep, it will be a great benefit to me just to show Shawn like, hey, my listeners, they don’t just listen, they take action shots. You’re making a difference with your software. So greatly appreciated. I can’t thank you enough for for the hard work and labor. And I just hope that this is one of those tools, especially for Active Campaign users. That really gets a high adoption rate. Because you we really need to protect our database. And if I’m being honest, those those price increases haven’t haven’t felt the best for a lot of users. So if you want to trim the fat and make sure that you only have the people that really want to hear from you and they’re aligned with the right messaging, you’ve got to like email prof to help you Sean, thank you so much again for jumping online man and recording this podcast with me. I greatly appreciate it.

Shaun Pereira 34:03
Thank you so much. Chris was in addition, looking forward to breakfast basically you will prep. Yes,

Chris 34:08
absolutely. All right, everyone. Thank you for listening. And until next time, I see you online. Automate responsibly, my friends. Thank you for tuning in to this episode of The all systems go podcast. If you enjoyed it, make sure that you’re subscribed at the time of recording the all systems go podcast is free to subscribe to and it can be found in Apple podcast, Google podcasts, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts new episodes are released every Thursday. So make sure you’re subscribed so that you don’t miss out and while you’re at it, please leave us a five star rating and review to show some love but also to help future listeners more easily find the podcast so they can experience the value of goodness as well. We’ve compiled all resources mentioned on the past cast, as well as other resources that are extremely valuable and effective at helping you grow your marketing automation skills quickly, and you can access them all at all systems go podcast.com Thanks again for listening and until next time I see you online. Automate responsibly, my friends

Narrator 0:00
You’re listening to the all systems go podcast, the show that teaches you everything you need to know to put your business on autopilot. Learn how to deploy automated marketing and sale systems in your business the right way with your host, the professor of automation himself and founder of automation bridge, Chris Davis.

Chris 0:30
Welcome everybody to another episode of The all systems go podcast. I’m your host, Chris L. Davis. And today, we’re going to discuss a topic that is extremely important in today’s day and age, you know, where we’re in a time where email deliverability, security, lists growth, all of these things are paramount. There was a day and age where you would be kind of like a unicorn if you knew these terms, and we’re doing these things. But now it’s really more tongue in cheek for the regular business owner and digital marketer. And along with that comes a responsibility to make sure that you can properly manage people based on their preferences. And that’s what we’re going to be discussing today, a new software that I’m looking forward to you meeting the founder and the software of and our guest for today is Sean Pereira. And at just 25 years, young, Sean is already making waves as a visionary entrepreneur, with a proven track record as the founder of a contact sharing company, which he successfully sold Shaun now leads email pref, the software that we’ll be talking about today as a CEO, and he’s passionate about simplifying user preferences, while empowering businesses to gain deeper insights into their users when he’s not revolutionising the tech world. You can find him enjoying a cup of coffee or cheering his favorite football team on the weekends. Sean, welcome to the podcast. So glad to have you. How you doing?

Shaun Pereira 2:20
Thank you so much, Chris, for this invitation. All good. Yeah, just bad weather knocks that I’m right now, but excited for this podcast?

Chris 2:27
Yes, yes. And I want to give people some quick insight on how we connected. I actually can’t remember how I learned how I learned to have the software. But the minute I saw what it could do, especially and specifically for Active Campaign, it was a no brainer, you were very, very receptive of my outreach. And we connected you shared the vision for the software to me, I caught the vision immediately. And I was like, Oh, my goodness, all my years there, all of the customer complaints. And I think tanks that we had internally have things we can do. And thankfully, somebody finally took the sword took the took the flag out, say and went to the finish line with it. And now we have email prep. So so let us know, Shawn, what where did the idea of email prep come from?

Shaun Pereira 3:31
So take a step back before that actually, before preference, or do we just simply an unsubscribe link. And as you know, all companies believe in innovation and all that’s what we also actually strongly believe in as our company. So founders vision was basically to keep something really simple for the end customer to use, since he wanted non technical and technical users to set up email. And in an easy way. So going back again, we started with an unsubscribe link. And we’re not speaking to customers, we’re sending out cold emails. That’s when I realized, oh, people actually ask for beautiful preference. And though there’s no actually software, which can actually help customers, like businesses create a beautiful preference center where they can include the logo favicon and decide the list they want to show on the preference center. So with that, we just started with a small POC, and we targeted the Campaign Monitor first, the response was really good. And one of the campaign monitors actually use Active Campaign. And they told us they’re switching. And that’s how they told us Oh, could you make a preference and Active Campaign? So we made a preference and effective campaign. And that’s when we realized the users told us that Oh, like Active Campaign does not have a preference and it just has. So this is where we learned and we pivoted email prep into complementing Active Campaign and having a whole group preference and for all the Active Campaign users. Love

Chris 4:46
it, love it in. Just so everybody is tracking on the same plane here when we talk about preference centers. Think about when you send an email or how about this think about when you receive it. Email, and you click that unsubscribe, or perhaps they have a update, your preferences are your subscription button at the bottom at the footer of the email, you click it, and it takes you to this page shake of the dice. It’s a well optimized page or what sometimes you click in and it’s just like, your your settings have been saved. And you’re like, what settings. But usually, if the software does it, right, there’s a page where it can, it will show all of the lists or all of the types of messaging that you’re subscribed to. So you look because what happens often, Shawn is that I opt in to something a contact may opt in for something, but they don’t know all the list that they’re being added to, they don’t know the back end messaging structure and setup. So a lot of times when you click on that, unsubscribe link, or update, it’s your first time seeing all of the things that you’ve been subscribed to. And now I can select and say, Hey, I don’t want this, but I want this or, Hey, remove me from everything. So this is the software that Sean has built, Sean and his company have have built that integrates so tightly with Active Campaign. As before that I think you had to do, like Active Campaign form, with lists, and it was limited to lists, you know. So in in comes email press. And just describe to us how how you handle the preference page building, and then the association with lists and tags and things of that nature.

Shaun Pereira 6:38
So let me just jump in and share my screen pretty quick. And again, just show them a setup. If that works. Yes. So this is on the left hand side, as you see, it’s my email prep dashboard. And on the right hand side, it’s my Active Campaign sandbox. So I’ll jump through stuff really quick here, since I just want to show you Oh, you saw right now just add the integration with Active Campaign. So I’ll click on add the integration, and keep track of campaign. I’ll just create Sean podcast that just won’t show on podcast here. And we asked for an API key and URL. This is for a secure integration, you can find that information under Settings on your Active Campaign sandbox, which is on the developer URL change or reset my API key and you are allowed for this. So just to be safe.

Chris 7:20
For those of you watching video, it will not work if you try. For those of you listen, yeah, Shawn is just showing your regular interface of going into Active Campaign grabbing your API key, putting it in an email prep. And that’s what’s going to authorize that initial connection to allow it to start to read data from Active Campaign.

Shaun Pereira 7:42
Okay, that’s exactly what I’ve mentioned. And we also have enterprise security. So this adds a UU ID as a custom field on Active Campaign. This is only for enterprise levels currently. So I’ll just accept. And this will give me a pop up saying sit back and relax, while we are syncing all your lists. So this is what I really want to emphasize on sit back and relax. This is where evil breath actually starts to work. So I’ll just show you my list from Active Campaign right now, if I just go into sandbox and click list, I can see all my lists from Active Campaign here on the right hand side. So now when email ref does the work, if I show you the list tab on email prep, this fetches all your list and tags from active campaigns, Yes. and gets it to email prep. So this is where the customer does not have to do anything does not have to create a Sync does not have to create a bidirectional thing, not a one way sync nothing. All they have to do is create an integration. This is how easy we are making it for users right now. And the last step is on the email breath creating actions. So we also create default actions for users. So any page made on the preference page, we send it back to Active Campaign in real time for real time updates between active campaign and email press.

Chris 8:54
Yes, so the last step, yep, keep going. No, drive this thing.

Shaun Pereira 9:02
Perfect. So the last step, Chris, which everyone is actually very fussy, is create your reference page. So we have kept it really simple. I’ll just click Create Page right here. We asked you for particular data to keep the reference page as per your brand guidelines. So your company name, I’ll just put Shawn here pretty quick. And he’ll be a spot. So the main reason we have kept apart is because we allow you to create multiple reference pages. So say you have different target markets, different target audiences, you can have a different reference page for all the target audiences keep it simpler for your audiences also at the same time, so I’ll just keep preferences you’re pretty quick. And we also have logo and favicon to customize the page completely. So we also have customize the page where you can change the colors which is really simple. If you click on the color will change and you can also change the button color. The most interesting part is the list. Email draft gives you two predefined list, but I’ll just delete this since I’m showing you an Active Campaign integration completely. So I’ll delete this and click on Add list. So we give you a drop down and a search box at the same time. So now if I click on the drop down, it will show me the list from Active Campaign specifically. So if you see your the list, I see all the lists on my left, and on the right and Active Campaign, I can see all the lists. So let’s see, I’ll select master contact list. Okay. And right now I can change the name on email prep. So the master contact listed on Active Campaign. But what I want to show the customer is what I can define in the name and description to help the users understand what types of emails they will receive, and when. So this helps you segment your users basically. So I’ll just keep master contact list and I’ll just add members only just to give an understanding so you can change the description to whatever you like. And description. I’ll keep member news. Member news unsafe. I’ll add another list which is what Chris which lists the one marketing newsletters.

Chris 10:51
Let’s let’s do newsletters,

Shaun Pereira 10:53
newsletters, Okay, should I keep it automation bridge newsletters, yes. Automation bridge. News, I’ll just give automation bridge news now. So you can give the description as as for whatever you want just to make it clear for your audience what the subscribing to or what they’re unsubscribing from. And save. So I’ll just add another list also, which is sales, and just keep it one on one just to understand what’s happening. And save. So as you can see on the right, we already have a preview of our preference page.

Chris 11:26
So the last thing, we want to catch everyone up real quick, Shawn, as you’re moving, what what’s happening for those of you listening, you’re just like, oh, wow, this is it sounds cool. We’ve at he’s synced active campaign with email prep, it has pulled in all of the lists from Active Campaign. So check mark there. However, one of the things that that email prep allows you to do is create various preference pages. So you may have a preference page for leads maybe a different one for customers, maybe a different one for partners, right? Just to give a different experience. And you can set up different lists that they can be a part of or not now, email PrEP has lists that can connect to Active Campaign lists, tags or custom fields, right. I think all three

Shaun Pereira 12:24
are just tags, how many tags, tags and list? We are working on customizing this? Yes.

Chris 12:29
So what you’re doing is you’re creating your so this may be a little confusing for people because they’re like, but here are my lists. What is a list and Active Campaign and email prep? When I’d already synced my list? Why am I creating more? This is the override that you’ve been waiting for. Now, you can say, Okay, I have a main list. But I really have three topics that I mail on for that main list. With those three things. I have a mailing list, I send a newsletter, I send a podcast announcement and I sin webinar updates. Well, I can create an inactive campaign. Those are just tags, right that create segments. So now an email pref, I can create lists that are connected with those tags. And now when someone as you see on the screen, when someone clicks the toggle to say, hey, I want that type of communication. I don’t want this type of communication, though it’s a list in email pref. It’s actually toggling the tag condition and or list condition to add it or remove it to make it true. So that you don’t have to do anything but continue to send to your list in your segments. And email. pref is really handling all the management of your of your contacts.

Shaun Pereira 13:50
I think you hit the nail right on its head. I couldn’t have explained it better. But I just show that also we can show the customers about tags also. Yes, so I’ll just say of the preference page right now. And we can show a preview of a preference page. So I’ll just take contacts. Let’s take one of my contacts make it easy for my sandbox. Yeah,

Chris 14:09
and I’ll say this. There’s two platforms that I commonly unsubscribe from, because I get a lot of emails. But the pages that I see the most are HubSpot and Ontraport Ontraport are two that have a really I will say functional unsubscribe experience where you can where it does list everything that you’re part of haven’t seen it with key yet or maybe CLEVEO does it as well. ActiveCampaign doesn’t do it. Anyways. So some of you may have already seen pages like this and didn’t just didn’t realize that that’s a preference page.

Shaun Pereira 14:47
Exactly. So going back to the demo itself, we’re showing right now after Chris said or even for makes it really easy for you. If you have an integration listed in the on your dashboard and the reference page. It gives you the link which you can copy and paste in your Active Campaign template. So you don’t have to do anything, just copy this link and paste it in your Active Campaign template. So right now just a quick demo with [email protected]. So I’ll just put the query string email here [email protected]. And so this will take me to a different page, legal reference page. Okay, so now we see Shawn is the scribe of sales, unsubscribe from newsletter, and unsubscribe from Master contact, let’s, let’s see if this is the information shown in Active Campaign. So if I go to Active Campaign and see Sean has unsubscribed from Moscow and abuse, which is the right information on display from newsletters, and only subscribe to sales. So this is actually the right information from the reference page. So let’s just toggle something off and on and reference page. So let’s play around, say, and describe them sales, subscribe to newsletters, and subscribe to my contact list. And do not forget to save your preference pages. Because this is where it gives you a pop up, your preferences have been saved. Okay, so I’ll just go to a campaign refresh this real quick. And if you see all the information on Active Campaign will be related in real time. So if you see I unsubscribe from sales, subscribe to my contact list. And now we have newsletters, also. So this is how email pref actually functions with Active Campaign. Just Just one last thing close, I just want to show the information relayed from Active Campaign to email prep. So say by mistake if a user subscribes, if you want to change it to Active Campaign, I’ll just put unsubscribe here. So I changed this on Active Campaign. So now let’s see if the information on email prep really is the same in real time. If so, the webhook we have received is a little late, let me just check this again,

Chris 16:46
is checking that everyone, what you’re seeing or listening to is the rate, the live sync when something is taking place. And you’re on email prep the preference page that you set up, you’re saying, hey, the contact is saying I no longer want this. And I no longer want that. We log into Active Campaign. And it’s showing exactly that. So we’ve got lists and Active Campaign, integrated with email prep, email PrEP has lists that display to the customer. And now the customer is controlling the customer is in full control now of what is taking place in Active Campaign in terms of what list they’re on and what type of messaging they receive.

Shaun Pereira 17:33
Exactly. And again, Chris does a really good use case since I made a change in Active Campaign. And as you can see, the change is not live in email prep. So this is basically the webhook from Active Campaign has been delayed or come late to us. So this is where email prep doesn’t nightly sync. So all these errors do not happen. So if that customer changed the preference for the day, we do have a Nike thing in place, which before the next campaign is sent out, all these preferences are taken in place, and it’s updated in real time. So this is actually a really good use case for Kim, on this live right now on the podcast.

Chris 18:03
Beautiful, beautiful. And and I’ll say this, it’s time every one for you to start thinking how to properly manage and maintain your database in a way that now you have a preference page really makes sense. Right? So now, maybe in we know it’s a little tough. Well, it’s very tough right now in active campaign with with segments at the time of recording, hopefully, at the time of you listening, they’ve made an update, or at least something. But it’s really hard to see those segments, those who are experienced in the space can have a list and then have tags or custom fields that create segments that people send to. Well, what we’ve had to do in the past is add a link to the bottom that’s above the unsubscribe link and say, Hey, if you no longer want this type of communication, click here. And they click here. And then it either removes a tag or updates a custom field or so on. And that segment and then they’re removed from that segment. Well, email prep comes right in and says hey, look, we got it from here. Just create a page tell us what type of communication you would like people to be able to subscribe to or unsubscribe from. And we’ll handle all of the tag removal and toggling and lists subscription and unsubscription. So really powerful, powerful application and speaking of applications, Shawn, what are some of the the most prevalent and powerful use cases that you’ve seen lately or just over the time of customers that use email prep?

Shaun Pereira 19:49
So firstly, use case right now we will make a use case where we have is on tags because what people want to do is add a listen to your breath and link it to a particular tag. So this is where they can segment the audience in is a really good way this is actually going over what you said again, but if like a company does not have not seen this working in real time, so I would like to show that in another video probably possibly down the line. But basically, once they see this in real time and live to like, wow, this is actually sending real time updates and helping a segment of customers. So from a business perspective, they are understanding the customers in a better way. And from a user perspective, they are receiving the information they want to receive and not getting spammed by the companies. So this is one of the major use cases. The other one will be I’ve seen is a spike in people updating preferences. And some people actually using a lot of lists. One of our big clients actually use a lot of lists, they are our final, final key contacts, and they use a lot of lists. So they just sent an email saying that, hey, you guys can update the preferences. And they have 10 different lists. They saw like a 120 7% spike, which actually customers updated their preferences instead of just unsubscribing from everything. So this actually played a major role in user retention, which the company just came to us. He was like, Why did you guys not reach out to us? And we’re like, we didn’t know you guys actually needed this. So here we are.

Chris 21:07
And again, it speaks to the the reality that your contacts don’t know, they received an email, went to a landing page, maybe saw your stuff in an ad on social media. And they said, oh, I want that. Or hey, I would like to receive communication around that. They didn’t realize that they’re also getting other versions, or maybe there’s derivatives of that type of messaging. So just so it’s it just because it’s a newsletter, they didn’t realize that perhaps they’re also getting podcast announcements. And maybe they don’t want that maybe they’re like, oh, wow, this is great. Such added value, I only got one thing and I signed up for one. And I’m getting to as long as your communication is clear. So now when they say, Well, look, you know what I’m tired of getting these announcements. Let me just get out of here. And they think that that’s all you are, are just announced podcasts announcements, they say, Okay, I’m done. And then they go to this preference page. And I say, oh, wait a minute, I didn’t realize I could just get the newsletter and not the product updates or podcast announcements. In fact, I actually don’t need the newsletter, I just need the product updates. And they’re still they’re still a valuable contact that you can reach and that you can continue to send messaging to all because you’ve properly handled the unsubscribe process. So it was really good to hear that a use case of 500,000 contacts, were able to some of those we’re able to be saved. Speaking of sizes, email prep, is it for businesses of all sizes, or their particular sweet spot? It’s like, Hey, you get the most out of this platform, if you’re this size of database or whatnot, or does it not matter?

Shaun Pereira 23:00
To be honest with it does not matter. We want to help all the businesses using Active Campaign and other ESPs also at the same time. So we don’t want to keep it like oh, if you’re a small business, we want cater to you. Of course, we will guarantee you we care about you. It’s not like we’re not going to give you support. But we want you to take the best use make the best use out of email press even if you’re small objects. But if it’s already a use case, we’re happy to help you. Yep, yeah,

Chris 23:23
well, that’s, that’s good. Shawn, I have to put myself on display here. And I’m saying this so that everybody can can understand that you’re not the only ones that struggle, okay. I was so excited when I got email prep, the first thing that I did, I jumped into my active campaign account, I was like, I’m ready to go. And I realized every one I had just just by the nature of doing things on the fly and, you know, updating as you need to I step back, and I committed one of my own cardinal sins, which is never use negative logic. So don’t say has not, don’t say no to something that has not been done because then that’s yes, no and no equals yes. Confusing every time I even say it. But I realized I was using negative logic. I was using negative logic to do my to do my segmentation, which essentially meant, if you don’t have this tag, then send the information, information or flip it. If you say I don’t want this information, then we tag you as you don’t want the information. So in that case, it it would invert the logic for email prep. And I’m saying that to say now was a great time for you to audit all to start thinking about how are you managing your your preferences. Again, this was email prep didn’t exist at the time that I made this decision and for the team in my execution. And at the time, it was easy to just apply a tag, and that tag removed them from a segment. So I had to reimagine and redo how we run unsubscribes. For someone just getting started, are there some pointers that you would give, give that new user, Shawn, to be able to get started in the most clean and streamlined fashion?

Shaun Pereira 25:24
So, to be honest, I don’t I’m not a big user of Active Campaign. So I can’t advise on this. But from the customers I’ve spoken to, a lot of people are using list and ads at the same time. And when it comes to email prep, they just think email prep works with lists. But not my first question to them always is, what are you working with? Are you working with lists or tags, and they tell me I’m working with list, but basically on tags, I’m just using, oh, if this customer clicks on this property, they’re interested in this also. So I was like, okay, so email draft solves the use case on list, and tags also at the same time. So basically, what I tell them is first, solve the use case on list. And then whenever you use case and list to solve, then jump on the tags. But if you mix, you can also mix it like that doesn’t matter. But it should fit exactly in your workflow and not take time of that business to change the complete workflow. That’s what our main goal and perspective is on this right now.

Chris 26:16
Yeah, it goes without saying but worth repeating that your sentiment of positive sentiment across your email database is going to go a long way. They are cracking down everyone we are in the midst of this last year, they did it, Apple did a big privacy update. This year, Google and Yahoo did a big update with their email deliverability and authenticating your service sending it is going to be extremely important that you maintain a positive sentiment in relationship with your database. Because all of these email providers are looking for that, hey, are people saying this is spam are people unsubscribing at a very high rate. So you want to be able to use tools and leverage tools that allow you to keep that positive sentiment, instead of somebody saying this is spam. When they unsubscribe, they can say oh, wait a minute. Actually, I don’t want any of it goodbye. Because we want to unsubscribe, we don’t want to spam complaint, we want to unsubscribe. So this is giving you another layer of clarity to communicate exactly what people are getting, I would like to go to the next level Shawn and say, you on your landing pages or wherever you’re getting collecting this information, make sure you are very clear with the communication that they will receive. If at any point, if at any point, you’re sending them information. In addition, say hey, look, sign up for our daily newsletter. And then there’s a promotion that’s coming up. And you’re like, oh, I want to send everybody who signed up for a daily newsletter. And you didn’t explicitly state that they would also receive promotions, we’ll make sure you have a tool like email pref that now has email promotions attached to either a tag or list. So when they see it, and they say wait, why are you promoting to me new stuff, I just wanted to newsletter and they click unsubscribe, they can go to a page and say, Oh, yes, I still want to newsletter just toggle off these new promotions. So it’s a way to protect yourself and maintain positive sentiment in the marketplace for your list. Shawn what what can we everybody that has that has been listening may be excited those who were are on YouTube following. By the way if you’re not subscribed to the automation bridge YouTube channel where you can see these demos with with founders like Sean when they walk through their software and attend live when I record these, you can do that at automation bridge.com For slash subscribe, but what what do you got in the oven? What’s what’s next for email prep? What are the things on the horizon that you’ve got your binoculars locked into and forging forward for?

Shaun Pereira 29:11
So actually, it’s what Chris has suggested, like when I was talking to Chris, he told me he’s having a problem with his paid users and unpaid users, because Chris has a community where he has paid users and unpaid users and basically the problem what Chris was facing, I mean, correct me if I’m wrong, Chris. But the problem he was facing is his paid users wanted to receive more emails from him and wanting to hear more from him. What is unpaid users also wanted to hear from him. But since they’re not paying him, he wants to send different emails to his paid users and unpaid users. So this is directly with it coincides with email preference, dynamic lists, visibility, so you can show and hide list on your preference page, depending if that customer has a particular tag of paid or whatever. And that could come in, depending on how you set it up. All this is made on the backend right now and we onboarding customers Currently right now, and it’s really interesting, because that’s a really cool feature all because of you, Chris, actually, thanks to you for that feature, selection, and we onboarding all the customers right now for that one. And the last one is language support just for different languages.

Chris 30:14
Yeah, that’s good. And I want to say this. The reason why this even came up between Shawn and I was because we often have this misconception of bothering our customers, we don’t want to scare them away shot, it’s like they gave us money, don’t say anything to them anymore, just leave them be. And that’s actually the opposite of what they want. A lot of times they want to be in the know, they want to, they don’t want to be left out, you know, if you’ve got really good content, they’re like, Hey, can I get some of that. And what I found is that sometimes people will even opt in again, with a different email just so they can get the non customer emails. So they don’t want to be left out. So that may be something that’s taking place in your business, now you have a tool to allow you to more easily keep them involved. And if they don’t, they can easily say, You know what, I’m fine with just logging in and getting that experience. So, Shawn, I can’t thank you enough for stopping by and showing us email prep, thank you, personally, for creating this tool. My team is underway working heavily to get this implemented. So by the time you all hear this podcast, if you have an email for me, and you hit update, you should see a nice email prep page with my logo at the top. Now you know where it came from. And now you know, the founder. So for those that want to learn more about email prep, get set up, what’s the pricing structure? Where can they go to find out more and get an account started?

Shaun Pereira 31:53
Everything’s live on the website, I get an email pref.com. And everything’s on the website, shall I just pop out the website real quick? Sure. So okay, so on my screen right now, you’ll be able to see it. So if you just pop in the pricing, pricing is live on the website at the bottom, which is we have essentials, which is up to 5000 users, that’s $10 a month. And we have different features. So our most popular one is the Pro. This is basically because what I mentioned, Chris, actually dynamic, dynamic lists, show and hide. A lot of people are opting into this. And we have a lot of users on Plus plan and enterprise enterprises. customers with more than 100k users. So we have 10 customers right now in enterprise and a lot of people on plus right now two plus nine. So this is the pricing right now. Don’t forget to use Chris’s code, you guys will get a discount. Chris, if you can mention your code on that one.

Chris 32:48
Yes, yes. Automation bridge. Yeah. Yes, it

Shaun Pereira 32:52
just automation bridge. So use Chris’s code, and you guys will get a discount for that one.

Chris 32:56
Yes. And everybody, the code is in the shownotes. It’s hyperlink, you can just click it or copy it go and get your discount with email prep, it will be a great benefit to me just to show Shawn like, hey, my listeners, they don’t just listen, they take action shots. You’re making a difference with your software. So greatly appreciated. I can’t thank you enough for for the hard work and labor. And I just hope that this is one of those tools, especially for Active Campaign users. That really gets a high adoption rate. Because you we really need to protect our database. And if I’m being honest, those those price increases haven’t haven’t felt the best for a lot of users. So if you want to trim the fat and make sure that you only have the people that really want to hear from you and they’re aligned with the right messaging, you’ve got to like email prof to help you Sean, thank you so much again for jumping online man and recording this podcast with me. I greatly appreciate it.

Shaun Pereira 34:03
Thank you so much. Chris was in addition, looking forward to breakfast basically you will prep. Yes,

Chris 34:08
absolutely. All right, everyone. Thank you for listening. And until next time, I see you online. Automate responsibly, my friends. Thank you for tuning in to this episode of The all systems go podcast. If you enjoyed it, make sure that you’re subscribed at the time of recording the all systems go podcast is free to subscribe to and it can be found in Apple podcast, Google podcasts, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts new episodes are released every Thursday. So make sure you’re subscribed so that you don’t miss out and while you’re at it, please leave us a five star rating and review to show some love but also to help future listeners more easily find the podcast so they can experience the value of goodness as well. We’ve compiled all resources mentioned on the past cast, as well as other resources that are extremely valuable and effective at helping you grow your marketing automation skills quickly, and you can access them all at all systems go podcast.com Thanks again for listening and until next time I see you online. Automate responsibly, my friends